Man kills 2 cops in apparent retaliation for police killings NYC

[twoskinsonemanns]

Especially coming from you, this is about the most vile insult you can throw and is clearly a direct violation of forumn rules. Abuse has been reported.

Always humorous when someone gets frustrated with losing a discussion and resorts to tattle-telling for rule breaking. :banana:

 

[The Truth]

Where is the evidence that it is actually increasing tyranny--rather than any other trigger--that is leading to these riots and murders?

Some things are not quantified in a news article. Some people define tyranny as "when the people fear the government." I think it's pretty simple actually. .gov would love nothing more than an unarmed populace. Localities continue to receive, free of charge, military grade weapons and vehicles. The first, fourth, and fifth amendments are constantly under attack. Peaceful protesters are corralled like sheep by the tacticool police teams wearing full body armor and carrying riot gear and tear gas. There is no more dialogue. Occupy Wall Street may have seemed pointless to a lot of people, but it along with other protests have continued to expose the oppressive nature of our government. There are videos of police pointing ARs at people in Ferguson, MO telling them, "I will blow your @#$%ing head off!" There were and are all kinds of rights trampling going on against peaceful people. For what? Control? We have rights. Any coercion that occurs to cause anyone to second guess a right is OPPRESSION.

The very existence of a permit to carry system where I live causes me to feel oppressed even though we are an OC state. It's not right that I can OC a pistol into WalMart but I can't carry a pistol into the woods during deer bow season even though Black v. US says OCing is not RAS that a crime is being committed. I understand that localities can make any gun laws they want for the most part, but where is the line drawn? This is just one instance in my state. I couldn't imagine how bad it is in other states. Any state that does not allow any form of carry except CC with a permit is an OPPRESSOR, and represents tyranny to me. "May Issue," is another prime example of oppression and tyranny.

"Criminal justice experts note that, while the federal government and national research groups keep scads of data and statistics— on topics ranging from how many people were victims of unprovoked shark attacks (53 in 2013) to the number of hogs and pigs living on farms in the U.S. (upwards of 64,000,000 according to 2010 numbers) — there is no reliable national data on how many people are shot by police officers each year.

The government does, however, keep a database of how many officers are killed in the line of duty. In 2012, the most recent year for which FBI data is available, it was 48 – 44 of them killed with firearms."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...ow-many-police-shootings-a-year-no-one-knows/

It's time to hold police accountable, NOW.

Obviously not, directly. But there is an emerging tone of being anti-police, anti-government, anti-law, on this board that is deeply troubling.

Charles

As long as posts don't advocate breaking the law, anarchy, voluntarism, anti-statism, etc. are not against any forum rule. I understand you are a religious conservative statist-type. I'm not going to claim that your philosophies flat-out disturb me. We are here for a common goal. Cop-bashing has been defined as broad-brush comments about police. It is my understanding that bashing cops that break the law in cited specific instances is also not against the rules.

 

[utbagpiper]

Always humorous when someone gets frustrated with losing a discussion and resorts to tattle-telling for rule breaking. :banana:

How does one "lose" a discussion? I recall one of your brethren recently claiming it was really "stupid" to even make a claim someone had "lost" a discussion.

Charles

 

[WalkingWolf]

Providing citations to support posting supposed facts is the backbone of this site. Demanding citations for opinions is silly and a member should know the difference. Pointing out obvious traits is not insulting, unless they are not true. Calling people illiterate or childish in some form or another is a personal insult and against the rules. Calling people trolls is also against the rules, but some of us don't live with our finger on the report button. Don't think because you are not called out it is not noted.

 

[rightwinglibertarian]

Let's see if the forum rules are enforced equitably or whether this supposedly pro-RKBA forumn has--despite supposed rules to the contrary--turned into a hotbed of cop bashing, anarchy, and personal insults toward any who don't tow the most radical libertarian line possible.

I'm not sure how you can honestly say that as i'm more libertarian than the powers that be here and there are several members who are very right-wing. Furthermore the very fact you have a forum rule prohibiting advocating the disobedience of unconstitutional laws does away with the 'most radical libertarian line possible' idea. Oh and whats more I myself have been warned against calling some police what they are (notice the word some in there). Speaking the truth is crime-speak so you're getting the radical idea from where?

 

[WalkingWolf]

How does one "lose" a discussion? I recall one of your brethren recently claiming it was really "stupid" to even make a claim someone had "lost" a discussion.

Charles

Whenever you claim you "won" a discussion you lost it. He didn't claim he won, he just claimed you lost, and you clearly have. You have sunken into throwing insults, though you openly admit reporting others, and fail to provide cites for what you claim are facts, while you admonish others for not on opinions.

Throwing up walls of text is also another sign of losing, just because some do not bother to read them.

 

[utbagpiper]

As long as posts don't advocate breaking the law, anarchy, voluntarism, anti-statism, etc. are not against any forum rule. I understand you are a religious conservative statist-type.

I am not a statist and I find such language to be highly insulting. I think it is most often offered up by libertarians as an insult.

I am a conservative with certain libertarian leanings. That I am not willing to ride the libertarian train all the way to minarchy or anarchy does not make me a statist.

And yes, I understand that most posts have not violated the letter of the rules of the forum. But in total a couple of threads are creating a very concerning tone. The term damning with faint praise comes to mind. Or the old, "some of my best friends are [insert hated minority here]." A token "I don't condone murdering cops" from someone who has made multiple posts more or less justifying or at least understanding why someone else would murder cops, or minimizing the gravity of violence against cops leaves a distinct tone.

I appreciate that you are at least willing to engage in some discussion. I have little use for those who think one line bumper stickers as a rule are helpful to increasing understanding.

Charles

 

[WalkingWolf]

Little worm on a hook

[video=youtube;rL7EuKLY4cA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rL7EuKLY4cA[/video]

 

[utbagpiper]

Whenever you claim you "won" a discussion you lost it. He didn't claim he won, he just claimed you lost, and you clearly have. You have sunken into throwing insults, though you openly admit reporting others, and fail to provide cites for what you claim are facts, while you admonish others for not on opinions.

I've never claimed I've "won" a discussion. One time I noted that invoking the Nazis was a good sign someone had "lost". It was THAT claim over which you jumped. Do try to at least be honest and accurate in your claims. It is clear you are not the least bit evenhanded so I won't even try for that.

As for insults, if you want to claim for one second that you don't think accusing a man of wanting women to submit to rape isn't an insult, I'll probably hurt myself laughing. Try some honesty.

If you want to demand citations from me, ask for them from others. My start on this tread started with nothing more than a thoughtful post about what evidence we have that government oppression is actually increasing in any way meaningful to those who are rioting and murdering. So far, nobody but "the truth" has made the slightest attempt to actually discuss that.

Other have lobbed insults, tossed out red herrings, and resorted to one line bumper sticker sniping more appropriate to a grade school playground than any group supposedly interested in actually discussing issues. I thought this was a social lounge area where mature adults talked about issues and actually considered other points of vies. It seems a few folks think it is a place for group think where anything other than "+1" and "Me too" is to be met with "statist" and "citations demanded".

That is neither intellectually interesting nor even very entertaining.

Charles

 

[utbagpiper]

[video=youtube;rL7EuKLY4cA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rL7EuKLY4cA[/video]

Cute. But still not very much thought from you.

Got anything besides insults calculated to avoid breaking the rules?

Charles

 

[The Truth]

I am not a statist and I find such language to be highly insulting. I think it is most often offered up by libertarians as an insult.

I am a conservative with certain libertarian leanings. That I am not willing to ride the libertarian train all the way to minarchy or anarchy does not make me a statist.

And yes, I understand that most posts have not violated the letter of the rules of the forum. But in total a couple of threads are creating a very concerning tone. The term damning with faint praise comes to mind. Or the old, "some of my best friends are [insert hated minority here]." A token "I don't condone murdering cops" from someone who has made multiple posts more or less justifying or at least understanding why someone else would murder cops, or minimizing the gravity of violence against cops leaves a distinct tone.

I appreciate that you are at least willing to engage in some discussion. I have little use for those who think one line bumper stickers as a rule are helpful to increasing understanding.

Charles

Why do you find it insulting that my opinion is you come off as a statist? Why do you not consider yourself a statist? Are you anti-statist? It is not my intention to insult you, I am simply stating my opinion which I have gathered from your posts.

 

[WalkingWolf]

Cute. But still not very much thought from you.

Got anything besides insults calculated to avoid breaking the rules?

Charles

You have been given thoughts by all of us~you refuse to listen, post BS without fact, tattle when there is nothing to tattle, and insult others.

 

[utbagpiper]

Providing citations to support posting supposed facts is the backbone of this site. Demanding citations for opinions is silly and a member should know the difference. Pointing out obvious traits is not insulting, unless they are not true. Calling people illiterate or childish in some form or another is a personal insult and against the rules. Calling people trolls is also against the rules, but some of us don't live with our finger on the report button. Don't think because you are not called out it is not noted.

Do you really need a citation that the Branch Davidians didn't go looking for cops to murder on the street? Or that the government agents mounted a military style raid against the Davdian commune? Really?

If I say, "It is my opinion that the branch davidians didn't murder anyone" does that get me off the hook?

Look, I didn't come on demanding citations about government oppression. I didn't insult anyone for their view that government oppression had increased and was the catalyst for violence against cops. I offered some counter perspectives which were met with derision and insults. One member, alone, made any attempt to rationally discuss the topic.

Why are you so afraid of a differing opinion on the causes of riots and murders? I haven't said there isn't some rational reason. I've simply questioned the assertion that it is increasing government oppression. I've tried to look (however imperfectly) at the issue from the perspective of those engaging in the murders and riots rather than imposing my experience on them.

Why is that anything over than hostility and incivility toward cops gets interpreted as wanting women to submit to rape? You KNOW that was an insult when you lobbed it at me.

Those who most vocally claim that anything other than confrontation is ineffective seem to have no interest in actually looking objectively at how various States laws measure up to each other on the RKBA front compared to what tactics pro-gun individuals and groups in those States have used.

If you don't like my opinion and perspective, just say so. Or ignore me. There is no need to insult and attack simply because what I've seen work so well in my State isn't what you think is the best, most effective, or even proper way to make gains in your area.

I thought this site was about thoughtful discussion, not one liners intended to be as insulting as possible without violating the rules.

Charles

 

[The Truth]

It seems a few folks think it is a place for group think where anything other than "+1" and "Me too" is to be met with "statist" and "citations demanded".

That is neither intellectually interesting nor even very entertaining.

Charles

I think the point is you are asking for quantitative citations to the claim that "the government is oppressive," and yet refuse to provide a cite for a specific claim that WalkingWolf has requested.

 

[WalkingWolf]

Do you really need a citation that the Branch Davidians didn't go looking for cops to murder on the street? Or that the government agents mounted a military style raid against the Davdian commune? Really?

If I say, "It is my opinion that the branch davidians didn't murder anyone" does that get me off the hook?

Look, I didn't come on demanding citations about government oppression. I didn't insult anyone for their view that government oppression had increased and was the catalyst for violence against cops. I offered some counter perspectives which were met with derision and insults. One member, alone, made any attempt to rationally discuss the topic.

Why are you so afraid of a differing opinion on the causes of riots and murders? I haven't said there isn't some rational reason. I've simply questioned the assertion that it is increasing government oppression. I've tried to look (however imperfectly) at the issue from the perspective of those engaging in the murders and riots rather than imposing my experience on them.

Why is that anything over than hostility and incivility toward cops gets interpreted as wanting women to submit to rape? You KNOW that was an insult when you lobbed it at me.

Those who most vocally claim that anything other than confrontation is ineffective seem to have no interest in actually looking objectively at how various States laws measure up to each other on the RKBA front compared to what tactics pro-gun individuals and groups in those States have used.

If you don't like my opinion and perspective, just say so. Or ignore me. There is no need to insult and attack simply because what I've seen work so well in my State isn't what you think is the best, most effective, or even proper way to make gains in your area.

I thought this site was about thoughtful discussion, not one liners intended to be as insulting as possible without violating the rules.

Charles

"Need" has nothing to do with it. You posted a claim of fact, I asked you for a citation of the supposed fact. YOU still refuse to provide it even though it is the rules of the site.

 

[utbagpiper]

You have been given thoughts by all of us~you refuse to listen, post BS without fact, tattle when there is nothing to tattle, and insult others.

No. I've received opinions from Marhauls with the most insulting language he can muster. To a hardcore libertarian, there is nothing worse than a "statist". The Truth has offered up some good food for thought. But he alone.

You've engaged in drive by sniping and insults and then get upset when someone calls you on it and makes any attempt to have the rules enforced.

If you want to have a discussion about whether government oppression is increasing or what my motivate the murder of cops, then let's discuss those issues. Go ahead. Offer up something other than a thinly veiled insult or a one liner. Give me something thoughtful on the topic at hand.

If you can.

Charles

 

[utbagpiper]

"Need" has nothing to do with it. You posted a claim of fact, I asked you for a citation of the supposed fact. YOU still refuse to provide it even though it is the rules of the site.

This is really very pathetic. Those who can't discuss the topic, berate the process.

I posted a recollection of something almost entirely off-topic to this thread.. I've long since made clear I cannot provide any citation. Why do you keep coming back to it?

Would you care to move along and discuss the topic at hand? Or if you want to discuss the Branch Davidians and federal government raid at Waco, then let's discuss it. You start with your thoughts.

Charles

 

[WalkingWolf]

This is really very pathetic. Those who can't discuss the topic, berate the process.

I posted a recollection of something almost entirely off-topic to this thread.. I've long since made clear I cannot provide any citation. Why do you keep coming back to it?

Would you care to move along and discuss the topic at hand? Or if you want to discuss the Branch Davidians and federal government raid at Waco, then let's discuss it. You start with your thoughts.

Charles

And you keep making excuses for not posting responsibly and following the rules.

 

[rightwinglibertarian]

No. I've received opinions from Marhauls with the most insulting language he can muster. To a hardcore libertarian, there is nothing worse than a "statist"

Hard core libertarian? *blinks* Well if you think this forum is anything close to that, you're as clueless as Obama himself. Interesting you ignored my previous comment and carried right on. Maybe you had no answer to the real truth

 

[The Truth]

Why do you find it insulting that my opinion is you come off as a statist? Why do you not consider yourself a statist? Are you anti-statist? It is not my intention to insult you, I am simply stating my opinion which I have gathered from your posts.

^^^