Definition of 'valid identification'?

[MyWifeSaidYes]

ORC 2923.126 says a licensee must be "carrying a valid license and valid identification", but it does not define what 'valid identification' means.

I've been told that it means a valid, state-issued ID card or driver license.

BUt which law says that?

 

[MAC702]

Here is my non-authoritative guess. If it is a state law asking for identification, it should be identification issued by the state, unless the state has elsewhere specifically recognized another form.

 

[MAC702]

There is just something (I don't know how to tactfully put this) VILE about using federal identification for purposes other than foreign travel.

 

[davidmcbeth]

§3503.16(B)(1)(a) and 3505.18(A)(1)

For one to vote, valid ID must be shown and this could include:

Current and valid photo identification, defined as a document that shows the individual’s name and current address, includes a photograph, includes an expiration date that has not passed, and was issued by the U.S. government or the state of Ohio
Current utility bill
Current bank statement
Current government check, paycheck or other government document


The law, as you wrote, does not ask for photo ID ... so I would use the voter ID requirements ... but hey, that's just me

 

[davidmcbeth]

See the REAL ID Act of 2005, Pub.L. 109–13, 119 Stat. 302, enacted May 11, 2005 and the 100 mile Constitution Free Zone

http://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights-constitution-free-zone-map

I just laugh at these .... no court can say that you have no rights in the USA. Nor legislative body.

 

[eye95]

ORC 2923.126 says a licensee must be "carrying a valid license and valid identification", but it does not define what 'valid identification' means.

I've been told that it means a valid, state-issued ID card or driver license.

BUt which law says that?

This is probably an historical remnant from when a driver's license was not necessarily an ID. For example, years ago, a DL from NY was not very good for identifying the holder. Were that person to be stopped while driving in OH, the officer couldn't be sure that the driver was the licensee absent some other form of ID. Now driver's licenses tend to BE ID, so if you have a DL, you also have the ID.

Just my guess as to how we got here. In Ohio, currently, your DL is a "valid identification."

 

[davidmcbeth]

This is probably an historical remnant from when a driver's license was not necessarily an ID. For example, years ago, a DL from NY was not very good for identifying the holder. Were that person to be stopped while driving in OH, the officer couldn't be sure that the driver was the licensee absent some other form of ID. Now driver's licenses tend to BE ID, so if you have a DL, you also have the ID.

Just my guess as to how we got here. In Ohio, currently, your DL is a "valid identification."

Not every adult has a DL...I know many that do not. Not that a DL is not a valid ID...it just cannot be the only...

 

[eye95]

Not every adult has a DL...I know many that do not. Not that a DL is not a valid ID...it just cannot be the only...

Um...duh...the OP is talking about the requirement for a DL and an ID while driving, clearly wondering why both would be needed.

Moving on from the stupidity of your distraction.

 

[davidmcbeth]

Um...duh...the OP is talking about the requirement for a DL and an ID while driving, clearly wondering why both would be needed.

Moving on from the stupidity of your distraction.

********************************

2923.126 [Effective Until1/1/2014] Duties of licensed individual.

(A) A concealed handgun license....

********************************

If OH is full of geniuses ... then eye is the person bringing the state's avg IQ back to normal ... Dweeb.

 

[Citizen]

One of the meanings for valid is to have legal force. So, I imagine they're talking about an unexpired government-issued identification of some sort.

If it gets too out of hand, then Kolender v Lawson would kick in. This was the case where CA's stop-and-identify statute was shot down because its definition of acceptable ID documentation was so vague as to give the cop unconstitutional latitude to arrest someone for violating the statute.

But, the statute in the present discussion seems to narrow it down quite a bit--only a valid identification document would fit, which I take to mean an unexpired government-issued identity document such as drivers license, state issued ID card, military ID, etc.

 

[Fallschirjmäger]

There is just something (I don't know how to tactfully put this) VILE about using federal identification for purposes other than foreign travel.

Respectfully, I must disagree. My state issued driving license and weapons licenses both state my home address which I may not like some busy body officer and all his buddies to know. A passport card does not list any information that could be compromising.

Is a home address important?
I dunno, ask to see Officer Friendly's driving license which lists his home address and see how happy he is about that. The most likely thing you're ever going to be presented with is a county or department issued card which lists a name and has a photograph and is likely of lesser quality than mos high school counterfeiters could whip up during their lunch break.

 

[davidmcbeth]

One of the meanings for valid is to have legal force. So, I imagine they're talking about an unexpired government-issued identification of some sort.

If it gets too out of hand, then Kolender v Lawson would kick in. This was the case where CA's stop-and-identify statute was shot down because its definition of acceptable ID documentation was so vague as to give the cop unconstitutional latitude to arrest someone for violating the statute.

But, the statute in the present discussion seems to narrow it down quite a bit--only a valid identification document would fit, which I take to mean an unexpired government-issued identity document such as drivers license, state issued ID card, military ID, etc.

The DOT seems to think that other non-governmental documents are acceptable. So it is vague as to what they mean.

 

[MyWifeSaidYes]

The statute does not say I have to carry a valid identification DOCUMENT, so wouldn't verbally giving my name, address and DOB qualify?

 

[davidmcbeth]

The statute does not say I have to carry a valid identification DOCUMENT, so wouldn't verbally giving my name, address and DOB qualify?

Are you "valid" ....

 

[JustaShooter]

The statute does not say I have to carry a valid identification DOCUMENT, so wouldn't verbally giving my name, address and DOB qualify?

But it also says you must be carrying said ID, which seems to mean something in your possession, not you yourself, no?

 

[MyWifeSaidYes]

Okay, maybe verbal ID won't cut it, but how about the CHL itself?

Can the one provide both? It does have name, address and DOB. And the Ohio BMV accepts the Ohio CHL as a primary identification document.

The law does not say that the license and ID have to be separate documents. I'm leaning toward the possibility that the lawmakers wanted valid ID for those other state CC licenses that may not have all 3 items listed.

The law regarding when we are required to ID ourselves (2921.29) only requires disclosure of name, address and DOB. The Ohio CHL has those.

It would seem that I do not require a separate form of ID if the CHL itself is valid ID.

 

[davidmcbeth]

Operator AND means "additionally a different item" in the law I would think.

2921.29 ... hmmmm interesting

DMV would take a gas bill as an ID record ....

One can call his state rep and ask for an opinion from them or the attny gen office ... if you want to deal with those a---

 

[eye95]

Again, folks, this is probably a remnant from when licenses were not IDs. Has anyone here ever been stopped and asked for that second ID???


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<o>

 

[Citizen]

Again, folks, this is probably a remnant from when licenses were not IDs. Has anyone here ever been stopped and asked for that second ID???


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<o>

Again? Did you think we didn't hear you the first time? Does it just bug you that others continue their individual lines of discussion so much that you feel you have to inject again whatever it is you think is the final word on the subject?

 

[JustaShooter]

Again, folks, this is probably a remnant from when licenses were not IDs. Has anyone here ever been stopped and asked for that second ID???

Not sure why you would think that - we aren't talking about what Ohio requires you to carry while driving but what Ohio says you must carry while carrying a concealed handgun in Ohio - whether on foot, in a vehicle or whatever.

Since ORC 2923.126 says "a licensee who has been issued a concealed handgun license ... may carry a concealed handgun anywhere in this state if the licensee also carries a valid license and valid identification when the licensee is in actual possession of a concealed handgun." I take it to mean the valid license is an unexpired/unrevoked Concealed Handgun License, and the valid identification to be an additional valid form of ID.

And yes, folks here in Ohio get asked for both their CHL and DL (and presumably some other form of ID absent a DL) when stopped by LEO.