Wirelesscto
Regular Member
imported post
JoeSparky wrote:
]]
Below is the whole code there is no delegated or definition of office use in the this section....
[37 FR 24346, Nov. 16, 1972, as amended at 38 FR 27824, Oct. 9, 1973; 41
FR 23955, June 14, 1976; 42 FR 17443, Apr. 1, 1977; 43 FR 38825, Aug.
31, 1978; 46 FR 898, Jan. 5, 1981. Redesignated and amended at 46 FR
34330, July 1, 1981; 47 FR 32113, July 26, 1982; 53 FR 29460, Aug. 5,
1988; 54 FR 20527, May 12, 1989; 57 FR 36903, Aug. 17, 1993; 57 FR
38443, Aug. 25, 1992; 63 FR 34600, June 25, 1998][/code]
JoeSparky wrote:
Wirelesscto wrote:JoeSparky wrote:Wirelesscto wrote:JoeSparky wrote:Wirelesscto wrote:Ok lets talk about anouther subject of great debate?
Post offices??? Is open and CCW legal in a post office if you are there to say pickup your mail???
I say yes after reading the federal Law what about you guys?Please provide a cite to the specific federal law you were reading!its was above but here is is againLooking at 18 USC 930, it would appear, at first blush, that carrying firearms is prohibited. That section provides:
So part of the confusion is rooted in the wording of this section. The prohibition applies to "Federal facilit(ies)" except as provide for in subsection (d). Subsection (d) provides:
- § 930. Possession of firearms and dangerous weapons in Federal facilities
Release date: 2004-08-06
a. Except as provided in subsection (d), whoever knowingly possesses or causes to be present a firearm or other dangerous weapon in a Federal facility (other than a Federal court facility), or attempts to do so, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 1 year, or both.
- (d) Subsection (a) shall not apply to-
(1) the lawful performance of official duties by an officer, agent, or employee of the United States, a State, or a political subdivision thereof, who is authorized by law to engage in or supervise the prevention, detection, investigation, or prosecution of any violation of law;
(2) the possession of a firearm or other dangerous weapon by a Federal official or a member of the Armed Forces if such possession is authorized by law; or
(3) the lawful carrying of firearms or other dangerous weapons in a Federal facility incident to hunting or other lawful purposes.
That is NOT the law that makes it illegal to carry in the post office. Try title 39 as is posted earlier in this thread.
Title 39 can only be enforced as stated by
q) Enforcement. (1) Members of the U.S. Postal Service security
force shall exercise the powers of special policemen provided by 40
U.S.C. 318 and shall be responsible for enforcing the regulations in
this section in a manner that will protect Postal Service property.
Ready this post as well
http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum65/7601.html
The enforcement power per this regulation can also be DELEGATED! per Title 39
I had previously seen the reference to Title 18 but since the OP had not posted which Federal law he was reading to make his determination, I felt it was incumbant upon someone to ask him.
]]
Below is the whole code there is no delegated or definition of office use in the this section....
Code:
[Code of Federal Regulations]
[Title 39, Volume 1]
[Revised as of July 1, 2001]
From the U.S. Government Printing Office via GPO Access
[CITE: 39CFR232.1]
[Page 55-58]
TITLE 39--POSTAL SERVICE
CHAPTER I--UNITED STATES POSTAL SERVICE
PART 232--CONDUCT ON POSTAL PROPERTY--Table of Contents
Sec. 232.1 Conduct on postal property.
(a) Applicability. This section applies to all real property under
the charge and control of the Postal Service, to all tenant agencies,
and to all persons entering in or on such property. This section shall
be posted and kept posted at a conspicuous place on all such property.
(b) Inspection, recording presence. (1) Purses, briefcases, and
other containers brought into, while on, or being removed from the
property are subject to inspection. However, items brought directly to a
postal facility's customer mailing acceptance area and deposited in the
mail are not subject to inspection, except as provided by section 274 of
the Administrative Support Manual. A person arrested for violation of
this section may be searched incident to that arrest.
(2) Vehicles and their contents brought into, while on, or being
removed from restricted nonpublic areas are subject to inspection. A
prominently displayed sign shall advise in advance that vehicles and
their contents are subject to inspection when entering the restricted
nonpublic area, while in the confines of the area, or when leaving the
area. Persons entering these areas who object and refuse to consent to
the inspection of the vehicle, its contents, or both, may be denied
entry; after entering the area without objection, consent shall be
implied. A full search of a person and any vehicle driven or occupied by
the person may accompany an arrest.
(3) Except as otherwise ordered, properties must be closed to the
public after normal business hours. Properties also may be closed to the
public in emergency situations and at such other times as may be
necessary for the orderly conduct of business. Admission to properties
during periods when such properties are closed to the public may be
limited to authorized individuals who may be required to sign the
register and display identification documents when requested by security
force personnel or other authorized individuals.
(c) Preservation of property. Improperly disposing of rubbish,
spitting, creating any hazard to persons or things, throwing articles of
any kind from a building, climbing upon the roof or any part of a
building, or willfully destroying, damaging, or removing any property or
any part thereof, is prohibited.
(d) Conformity with signs and directions. All persons in and on
property shall comply with official signs of a prohibitory or directory
nature, and with the directions of security force personnel or other
authorized individuals.
(e) Disturbances. Disorderly conduct, or conduct which creates loud
and unusual noise, or which obstructs the usual use of entrances,
foyers, corridors, offices, elevators, stairways, and parking lots, or
which otherwise tends to impede or disturb the public employees in the
performance of their duties, or which otherwise impedes or disturbs the
general public in transacting business or obtaining the services
provided on property, is prohibited.
(f) Gambling. Participating in games for money or other personal
property, the operation of gambling devices, the conduct of a lottery or
pool, or the selling or purchasing of lottery tickets, is prohibited on
postal premises. This prohibition does not apply to the vending or
exchange of State Lottery tickets at vending facilities operated by
licensed blind persons where such lotteries are authorized by state law.
(See Domestic Mail Manual 123.351 and 123.42; Administrative Support
Manual 221.42; Regional Instructions, Part 782, section IV G 2c.)
(g) Alcoholic beverages, drugs, and smoking.
(1) A person under the influence of an alcoholic beverage or any
drug that has been defined as a ``controlled substance'' may not enter
postal property or operate a motor vehicle on postal property. The
possession, sale, or use of any ``controlled substance'' (except when
permitted by law) or the sale or use of any alcoholic beverage (except
as authorized by the Postmaster General or designee) on postal premises
is prohibited. The term ``controlled substance'' is defined in section
802 of title 21 U.S.C.
(2) Smoking (defined as having a lighted cigar, cigarette, pipe, or
other smoking material) is prohibited in all postal buildings and office
space, including public lobbies.
(h) Soliciting, electioneering, collecting debts, vending, and
advertising. (1) Soliciting alms and contributions, campaigning for
election to any public office, collecting private debts, soliciting and
vending for commercial purposes (including, but not limited to, the
vending of newspapers and other publications), displaying or
distributing commercial advertising, soliciting signatures on petitions,
polls, or surveys (except as otherwise authorized by Postal Service
regulations), and impeding ingress to or egress from post offices are
prohibited. These prohibitions do not apply to:
(i) Commercial or nonprofit activities performed under contract with
the Postal Service or pursuant to the provisions of the Randolph-
Sheppard Act;
(ii) Posting notices on bulletin boards as authorized in
Sec. 243.2(a) of this chapter;
(iii) The solicitation of Postal Service and other Federal military
and civilian personnel for contributions by recognized agencies as
authorized by the Manual on Fund Raising Within the the Federal Service,
issued by the Chairman of the U.S. Civil Service Commission under
Executive Order 10927 of March 13, 1961.
(2) Solicitations and other actions which are prohibited by
paragraph (h)(1) of this section when conducted on Postal Service
property should not be directed by mail or telephone to postal employees
on Postal Service property. The Postal Service will not accept or
distribute mail or accept telephone calls directed to its employees
which are believed to be contrary to paragraph (h)(1) of this section.
(3) Leafleting, distributing literature, picketing, and
demonstrating by members of the public are prohibited in lobbies and
other interior areas of postal buildings open to the public. Public
assembly and public address, except when conducted or sponsored by the
Postal Service, are also prohibited in lobbies and other interior areas
of postal building open to the public.
(4) Voter registration. Voter registration may be conducted on
postal premises only with the approval of the postmaster or installation
head provided that all of the following conditions are met:
(i) The registration must be conducted by government agencies or
nonprofit civic leagues or organizations that operate for the promotion
of social welfare but do not participate or intervene in any political
campaign on behalf of any candidate or political party for any public
office.
(ii) Absolutely no partisan or political literature may be
available, displayed, or distributed. This includes photographs,
cartoons, and other likenesses of elected officials and candidates for
public office.
(iii) The registration is permitted only in those areas of the
postal premises regularly open to the public.
(iv) The registration must not interfere with the conduct of postal
business, postal customers, or postal operations.
(v) The organization conducting the voter registration must provide
and be responsible for any equipment and supplies.
(vi) Contributions may not be solicited.
(vii) Access to the workroom floor is prohibited.
(viii) The registration activities are limited to an appropriate
period before an election.
(5) Except as part of postal activities or activities associated
with those permitted under paragraph (h)(4) of this section, no tables,
chairs, freestanding signs or posters, structures, or furniture of any
type may be placed in postal lobbies or on postal walkways, steps,
plazas, lawns or landscaped areas, driveways, parking lots, or other
exterior spaces.
(i) Photographs for news, advertising, or commercial purposes.
Except as prohibited by official signs or the directions of security
force personnel or other authorized personnel, or a Federal court order
or rule, photographs for news purposes may be taken in entrances,
lobbies, foyers, corridors, or auditoriums when used for public
meetings. Other photographs may be taken only with the permission of the
local postmaster or installation head.
(j) Dogs and other animals. Dogs and other animals, except those
used to assist persons with disabilities, must not be brought upon
postal property for other than official purposes.
(k) Vehicular and pedestrian traffic. (1) Drivers of all vehicles in
or on property shall be in possession of a current and valid state or
territory issued driver's license and vehicle registration, and the
vehicle shall display all current and valid tags and licenses required
by the jurisdiction in which it is registered.
(2) Drivers who have had their privilege or license to drive
suspended or revoked by any state or territory shall not drive any
vehicle in or on property during such period of suspension or
revocation.
(3) Drivers of all vehicles in or on property shall drive in a
careful and safe manner at all times and shall comply with the signals
and directions of security force personnel, other authorized
individuals, and all posted traffic signs.
(4) The blocking of entrances, driveways, walks, loading platforms,
or fire hydrants in or on property is prohibited.
(5) Parking without authority, parking in unauthorized locations or
in locations reserved for other persons, or continuously in excess of 18
hours without permission, or contrary to the direction of posted signs
is prohibited. This section may be supplemented by the postmaster or
installation head from time to time by the issuance and posting of
specific traffic directives as may be required. When so issued and
posted such directives shall have the same force and effect as if made a
part hereof.
(l) Weapons and explosives. No person while on postal property may
carry firearms, other dangerous or deadly weapons, or explosives, either
openly or concealed, or store the same on postal property, except for
official purposes.
(m) Nondiscrimination. There must be no discrimination by
segregation or otherwise against any person or persons because of race,
color, religion, national origin, sex, age (persons 40 years of age or
older are protected), reprisal (discrimination against a person for
having filed or for having participated in the processing of an EEO
complaint--29 CFR 1613.26l-262), or physical or mental handicap, in
furnishing, or by refusing to furnish to such person or persons the use
of any facility of a public nature, including all services, privileges,
accommodations, and activities provided on postal property.
(n) Conduct with regard to meetings of the Board of Governors. (1)
Without the permission of the chairman no person may participate in,
film, televise, or broadcast any portion of any meeting of the Board or
any subdivision or committee of the Board. Any person may electronically
record or photograph a meeting, as long as that action does not tend to
impede or disturb the members of the Board in the performance of their
duties, or members of the public while attempting to attend or observe
a meeting.
(2) Disorderly conduct, or conduct which creates loud or unusual
noise, obstructs the ordinary use of entrances, foyers, corridors,
offices, meeting rooms, elevators, stairways, or parking lots, or
otherwise tends to impede or disturb the members of the Board in the
performance of their duties, or members of the public while attempting
to attend or observe a meeting of the Board or of any subdivision, or
committee of the Board, is prohibited.
(3) Any person who violates paragraph (n) (1) or (2) of this section
may, in addition to being subject to the penalties prescribed in
paragraph (p) of this section, be removed from and barred from
reentering postal property during the meeting with respect to which the
violation occurred.
(4) A copy of the rules of this section governing conduct on postal
property, including the rules of this paragraph appropriately
highlighted, shall be posted in prominent locations at the public
entrances to postal property and outside the meeting room at any meeting
of the Board of Governors or of any subdivision or committee of the
Board.
(o) Depositing literature. Depositing or posting handbills, flyers,
pamphlets, signs, poster, placards, or other literature, except official
postal and other Governmental notices and announcements, on the grounds,
walks, driveways, parking and maneuvering areas, exteriors of buildings
and other structures, or on the floors, walls, stairs, racks, counters,
desks, writing tables, window-ledges, or furnishings in interior public
areas on postal premises, is prohibited. This prohibition does not apply
to:
(1) Posting notices on bulletin boards as authorized in
Sec. 243.2(a) of this chapter;
(2) Interior space assigned to tenants for their exclusive use;
(3) Posting of notices by U.S. Government-related organizations such
as the Inaugural Committee as defined in 36 U.S.C. 721.
(p) Penalties and other law. (1) Alleged violations of these rules
and regulations are heard, and the penalties prescribed herein are
imposed, either in a Federal district court or by a Federal magistrate
in accordance with applicable court rules. Questions regarding such
rules should be directed to the regional counsel for the region
involved.
(2) Whoever shall be found guilty of violating the rules and
regulations in this section while on property under the charge and
control of the Postal Service is subject to fine of not more than $50 or
imprisonment of not more than 30 days, or both. Nothing contained in
these rules and regulations shall be construed to abrogate any other
Federal laws or regulations of any State and local laws and regulations
applicable to any area in which the property is situated.
(q) Enforcement. (1) Members of the U.S. Postal Service security
force shall exercise the powers of special policemen provided by 40
U.S.C. 318 and shall be responsible for enforcing the regulations in
this section in a manner that will protect Postal Service property.
(2) Local postmasters and installation heads may, pursuant to 40
U.S.C. 318b and with the approval of the chief postal inspector or his
designee, enter into agreements with State and local enforcement
agencies to insure that these rules and regulations are enforced in a
manner that will protect Postal Service property.
(3) Postal Inspectors, Office of Inspector General Criminal
Investigators, and other persons designated by the Chief Postal
Inspector may likewise enforce regulations in this section.
FR 23955, June 14, 1976; 42 FR 17443, Apr. 1, 1977; 43 FR 38825, Aug.
31, 1978; 46 FR 898, Jan. 5, 1981. Redesignated and amended at 46 FR
34330, July 1, 1981; 47 FR 32113, July 26, 1982; 53 FR 29460, Aug. 5,
1988; 54 FR 20527, May 12, 1989; 57 FR 36903, Aug. 17, 1993; 57 FR
38443, Aug. 25, 1992; 63 FR 34600, June 25, 1998][/code]